Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 13
  1. #1
    Elite Master Adoede's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    511

    Understanding Strategies

    Fine-tuning the strategies for your glads is one of the most difficult and yet most enjoyable parts of this game. And while strategies entail the secret sauce that makes each manager unique, there are some basic guidelines that are helpful for everyone that can be shared without ruining this "signature" aspect of the game. This thread is for veteran managers to share basic insights and for anyone to ask questions regarding strategies for running glads effectively in the arena. So without further ado, here are some basic things I've picked up along the way:

    1) What is Attack Power and Defense?
    While a precise definition is lacking in-game, attack power seems to be related to a few things: ability to hit opponent, chance of making a critical hit, chance of fumbling, chance of attacks being parried/blocked/deflected/dodged, general damage-range per hit, and initiative. Most of these things are self-explanatory, but what might not be so apparent are the latter two points. At least in my observations, when a glad has a higher attack power to opponent's defense ratio, their weapons can do full damage to their opponents. When that ratio is lower, their damage output is reduced correspondingly. Mind you, this doesn't mean boosting attack power will increase your damage beyond what your weapon is rated for - it just means you will be able to inflict full damage per attack. If you're already doing full damage per hit, then further boosting attack power doesn't increase damage...though it might increase the rate of critical hits you land.

    If your attack power / opponent's defense ratio is very high, you'll probably also see a lot more critical attacks against your opponent. Likewise, if your attack power / opponent's defense ratio is very low, you might find many of your attacks doing minimal damage or missing altogether. Additionally, some managers believe that a higher attack power gives a boost to initiative. The reason I mention these differences in a post on strategies is that raising activity and/or bloodlust both have a direct effect on your attack power and defense. This is key to understanding how strategies work.

    2) The effect of high activity
    In general, activity level seems to influence initiative, attack power, endurance and accuracy.
    Benefits: High activity will give you more attacks per round. For defensive styles, it gives you a higher parry-rate per round. It also helps you to get up from the ground faster when you get knocked down. A lower activity level boosts attack power. A higher activity level increases initiative (how many times you attack per round). There may also be some effect on defense, but I haven't noticed much here in this regard.
    Penalties: High activity will reduce your chances to hit your opponent and your accuracy in hitting the location you are aiming for. The more active you are, the faster you burn your endurance during the fight. Higher activity also increases the chance that you fumble your weapon or trip over your own feet during the fight. Too high an activity level results in a slightly out-of-control glad. All of these are reflections of how too high an activity level can reduce your attack power. Additionally, a low activity reduces your initiative.

    3) The effect of high blood lust
    In general, blood lust seems to effect damage, defense, attack power, endurance, and accuracy.
    Benefits: High blood lust allows you to do more damage per hit and seems to give a slight bonus to the number of attacks you make per round. It also seems to give you a slight initiative boost to give you a better chance to get the jump on your opponent.
    Penalties: While damage done is increased, high blood lust seems to result in slightly reduced attack power and lower accuracy in hitting the areas you are aiming for. It also plays a large role in increasing the rate of your endurance drain. Higher bloodlust also means lower defense - which can translate into taking more damage from each hit. A low bloodlust boosts defense and thus can reduce the amount of damage you take per hit.

    4) Effectively managing activity and blood lust
    As should be obvious from the above two points, if you notice your glad is having a hard time hitting their opponents and fumbling their weapons often, dropping activity levels and/or reducing blood lust will help to alleviate that problem. If your glad needs to be in more control during the fight, reducing activity and blood lust might be a smart thing to do. But pay attention to the ways that boosting activity effects your glads attack power, initiative, damage and accuracy. Likewise, watch how changing bloodlust effects defense, damage, accuracy, and endurance burn. You will need to "fine-tune" the strategies for each of your glads differently because they have different stats/gear/skill designs. Differences in stats means one glad might run effectively at activity level 9 while another does better at activity level 8.

    5) The order in which you slot your strategies is very important
    Your glad will check their triggers in the order they appear in your strategy page. So, not only do you need to come up with good triggers and adjustments to activity and bloodlust, but you also have to put those triggers in the correct order for them to be used effectively in the fight.

    In Stormcloak's words:
    "It is important to understand how the priority block is set up to ensure that your triggers fire appropriately and your strategy works. The basic setup runs on what appears to be a series of if/else statements. How this works is:

    If start of fight = true, then run line 1
    Else, if trigger 2 = true, then run line 2
    Else, if trigger 3 = true, then run line 3
    Else, if trigger 4 = true, then run line 4
    Else, if trigger 5 = true, then run line 5
    Else, run line 1

    What this means is that (asides from the start/standby line which is a little different), the higher the priority is in the sequence then it will over-ride all other lower priorities if its trigger condition is met. For example, if trigger 2 is met, then it will be the line running, even if triggers 1, 3, 4, and 5 are true. It is important to ensure you have your triggers in the correct sequence to ensure they don’t interfere with each other and do something different than what you intend."
    And the best way to make sure your strategies are triggering when you want them to trigger in actual fights is to…

    6) Use Jimmy’s Pit Fights and "easy" gauntlet runs to test strategies
    The Pits are not perfect since you don’t get to see how your glad performs with your gear design, but at least they give you the best place in the game to test out your various strategies to make sure they are working properly and to see if they improve the performance of your glad versus their actual actively managed peers. Weaw suggests that running the "easy" level of the gauntlet without allies can allow you to see your glad in action with their full gear on, though only against game-generated competition. Both of these avenues are useful for testing your strategies before implementing them in the arena.

    7) Don’t be afraid to be extreme in your strategies
    When testing various strategies, don’t be afraid to be extreme in trying out new ideas and new triggers. Be creative with your triggers and try to anticipate the various types of builds your glad is likely to encounter and design your five triggers to handle each of these “types” of opponents effectively. If you need some creative inspiration, then study the fights of glads that are well-run and you will get some ideas from when and how their triggers are used during their fights.

    8) Every point makes a difference
    It may not seem like going from a 5 activity to a 4 activity is a big deal, but you’ll be surprised how much of a difference that one point difference can make. Same thing goes for activity 10 to activity 9. Doesn’t seem like much of a difference at first glance, but might make a dramatic difference in your glads fighting effectiveness. Use the pits to try out different strategies and begin to get a feel for how a 7 activity works for your glad vs. an 8 activity, etc. Then you can really tailor a strategy for each of your glads that works for their build design.

    9) Strategies change based on the level of competition in your bracket
    You might think that once you get an effective set of strategies for your glad, you don’t need to fuss with it anymore. And while that is true here and there, I’ve noticed that every time the competition adjusts, I need to re-jigger my strategies to compensate. I also need to shift strategies if my glad re-distributes their skills or gets new gear with different stat/rank boosting attributes. When that happens, I need to re-adjust strategies to take advantage of that new build most effectively.

    10) Nearly any build can be run effectively if used with the proper strategies
    That brings me to this insight…there are a vast variety of builds that can be effective in this game IF they are paired with the proper set of strategies. Part of the continued fun of the game is that you can take an old glad, re-train their skills, race, and gear choices, and now you’ve got an entirely new fighter that needs brand new strategies to become effective. Learning to take an under-used build and make it competitive when others have failed at it is loads of fun.

    11) Have a vision for your glad and try to stick to it
    As other managers have noted, the most important aspect to finding success with your glad is to have a clear vision for them and to tailor skills, race, weapons, achievements and strategies to suit that vision. There are some builds that are highly effective in the blood gods level that don't show their value until all these pieces are in place - hybrid wars, hit 'n' run rages, snivler builds to name a few. Those who carry out their vision to the end often find the most success.

    That’s about all I can think of for now. Chime in if you have any other insights to share – but let’s keep the specifics secret so we don’t ruin the fun of discovery for the newer managers in the game.

    ___________________________________________


    Fighting Styles:

    Slash / Bash / Lunge (lvl 1)
    These basic attack styles get an attack bonus against particular armor types while maintaining decent defense and endurance management.
    Slash gets a bonus against Light Armor
    Bash gets a bonus against Medium Armor
    Lunge gets a bonus against Heavy Armor

    Berserk (lvl 18)
    Gives additional attacks per round and does more damage per round at the expense of much faster endurance burn and reduced defense.

    Kill Shot (lvl 13)
    Conserves endurance and gives a damage bonus to attacks made using this style. The tradeoff is that it greatly decreases the number of attacks made per round and doesn’t boost defense enough to compensate. Still, it can be useful in spots.

    Parry – X (lvl 13)
    The parry styles typically forego the initiative to the opponent while also cutting your glad’s attack frequency in half. But they significantly enhance defense and reduce endurance usage. They also seem to have an effect on the number of attacks your opponent is able to launch against you.

    Counter-attack (lvl 18)
    This is an attacking style that gives your glad extra attacks per round depending on how many times your opponent attacks you. The more often they attack you, the more attacks you counter in that round in addition to your normal attacks. This style also grants moderate defense. The added attacks your glad gains using this style results in added endurance burn in proportion to the number of attacks added counterattacking per round.

    Tank (lvl 18)
    This style gives a big boost to defense and seems to reduce damage taken from hits. It can be used to totally exhaust your opponents or it can be used in spots to provide defense before other triggers put you on the offensive.

    ___________________________________________


    List of Triggers:

    Time
    Round 1 (lvl 22)
    Round 2 (lvl 22)
    Round 3 (lvl 22)
    Round 4 (lvl 22)
    Round 5 (lvl 22)
    Round 6 (lvl 22)
    Odd Numbered Rounds (lvl 22)
    Even Numbered Rounds (lvl 22)


    Endurance
    I am slightly tired or more (lvl 10)
    I am moderately tired or more (lvl 10)
    I am very tired or more (lvl 10)
    I have less endurance than opponent (lvl 24)
    I have more endurance than opponent (lvl 24)
    Opponent is slightly tired or more (lvl 17)
    Opponent is moderately tired or more (lvl 17)
    Opponent is very tired or more (lvl 17)

    Health
    I am slightly injured or more (lvl 12)
    I am moderately injured or more (lvl 12)
    I am very injured or more (lvl 12)
    I am trying to give up (lvl 12)
    I am bleeding (lvl 27)
    I have less health than opponent (lvl 26)
    I have more health than opponent (lvl 26)
    I have taken damage (lvl 26)
    I have full health (lvl 26)
    Opponent is slightly injured or more (lvl 19)
    Opponent is moderately injured or more (lvl 19)
    Opponent is very injured or more (lvl 19)
    Opponent is trying to give up (lvl 19)
    Opponent is bleeding (lvl 27)

    Combat Effects
    I am disarmed (lvl 27)
    I am on the ground (lvl 15)
    I can not attack (lvl 29)
    I can not defend (lvl 29)
    I am entangled (lvl 50)
    I am blinded (lvl 30)
    I have an attack power bonus (lvl 31)
    I have an attack power penalty (lvl 31)
    I have a defense penalty (lvl 31)
    Opponent is stunned (lvl 15)
    Opponent is disarmed (lvl 27)
    Opponent is on the ground (lvl 15)
    Opponent can not attack (lvl 29)
    Opponent can not defend (lvl 29)
    Opponent is entangled (lvl 50)
    Opponent is blinded (lvl 30)
    Opponent has an attack power bonus (lvl 31)
    Opponent has an attack power penalty (lvl 31)
    Opponent has a defense penalty (lvl 31)

    Activity
    Opponent is slightly active (lvl 23)
    Opponent is moderately active (lvl 23)
    Opponent is very active (lvl 23)
    I attack more (lvl 28)
    Opponent attacks more (lvl 28)

    Specialty
    Opponent is Rage (lvl 20)
    Opponent is War (lvl 20)
    Opponent is Theatrics (lvl 20)

    Miscellaneous
    Disable this row (lvl 10)
    2nd Strategy row (lvl 10)
    Challenges and Avoids (lvl 11)
    3rd Strategy row (lvl 14)
    4th Strategy row (lvl 21)
    5th Strategy row (lvl 25)
    Last edited by Adoede; 01-13-2015 at 11:13 PM.
    Adoede | Tevrosin

  2. #2
    Aspiring Master Stormcloak's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    150
    Fantastic guide Adoede!
    This deserves a sticky

    The most important aspect I’ve found is to have a vision for your glad and to try and make sure the strategies fit in with the weapons, bonuses, and skills you’ve put together.
    And yes, you will definitely have to adapt your strategies based on what you're up against. What worked well in one bracket may not work so well in the next and it depends on the builds you're facing. This is even more true at the higher levels where glads that can beat your particular build may try to take advantage of that with the challenge system. If you're creative, you can set up some fairly intricate blocks of tactical logic and turn a struggling glad completely around. Reviewing your glad's fight performance definitely helps with this. Try to find triggers and levels that take advantage of your strengths or compensate for your weaknesses (or do the opposite for your opponent). And if you make a change, try to give it at least a few fights before you make a judgement call on it, unless you find something obviously incorrect in it (and keep notes so you can switch back if you have to!)
    Stable: Stormcloak
    Current Glads: Lachdanan (human war), Ecthelion (human war), Kedro (rage elaar), Acheros (war elaar), Tsiroth (war elaar)
    HOL Retirees: Rauthreygo (human war), Farkas (rage elaar), Vilkus (theatrics elaar), Thalvric (war elaar), Gamling (war dunder), Kresjack (theatrics elaar), Percivus (war spite), Agravaine (war elaar)

  3. #3
    Veteran Master weaw's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    340
    Thanks for guide, Adoede.

    I've made some tests, but still not sure: It's seems that high Agility smooths high-activity penalties, while high Chi smooths high-bloodlust penalties.
    That's correct?

    About testing strategies.
    It's easy for any gladiator to do the Gauntlet at Easy level without any ally.
    That give 6 fights against "dummies" using your own gear set.
    Perhaps, it's the good way to test Start-of-Fight strategies for activity/bloodlust settings and some triggering strategies (like Opponent-is-War, Opponent-is-Very-Active) too.
    Last edited by weaw; 12-15-2014 at 08:52 AM.

  4. #4
    Elite Master Adoede's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    511
    Thanks Stormcloak - And I agree that having a vision for your glad and sticking it out in skill selection, race selection and gear selection are critical to their success in the arena.

    And Weaw - High agility definitely helps with attack power for bladed weapons and accuracy overall, so saying a high agility mitigates the high-activity penalties is probably accurate. Perhaps more importantly, a weapon skill level of 10 allows your glad to fight effectively even at the highest activity levels. But these don't change the fact that relative to your peer competition, running at activity level 10 will make you slightly "out-of-control". That means it is easier for your opponents to defend against your attacks - and if you've ever run a glad at 10 activity vs. a counterattacking theatrics, you've probably noticed it is easier for those opponents to "surprise ending" your attacks back in your face. You might get away with it in the lower brackets, but blood gods level often requires a lot more nuanced strategy for your glad to remain effective. Don't know about the correlation between high chi and minimized bloodlust penalties.

    As for running easy gauntlets for testing - that's not a bad idea and might have its merits. I like the pit fights because you are up against actual optimized and actively managed glads running their real strategies. Watching how your glad fares against them is as close to real-arena conditions as you'll get in this game.
    Last edited by Adoede; 12-15-2014 at 08:20 AM.
    Adoede | Tevrosin

  5. #5
    Veteran Master weaw's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    340
    Quote Originally Posted by Adoede View Post
    I like the pit fights because you are up against actual optimized and actively managed glads running their real strategies. Watching how your glad fares against them is as close to real-arena conditions as you'll get in this game.
    You're definitely right. But it's works only for some types of weapons.
    For example, exotic weapons has so wide spectre not only by weight/speed, but by effects too. And i have no idea how to use pit fights to test theatric which uses whip as main-hand and falchion as off-hand.

    Anyway. Thanks for Your answers.
    Last edited by weaw; 12-15-2014 at 10:12 AM.

  6. #6
    Aspiring Master Stormcloak's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    150
    Just to elaborate on the priority system and how it works:

    How the priority block works:

    It is important to understand how the priority block is set up to ensure that your triggers fire appropriately and your strategy works. The basic setup runs on what appears to be a series of if/else statements. How this works is:

    If start of fight = true, then run line 1
    Else, if trigger 2 = true, then run line 2
    Else, if trigger 3 = true, then run line 3
    Else, if trigger 4 = true, then run line 4
    Else, if trigger 5 = true, then run line 5
    Else, run line 1

    What this means is that (asides from the start/standby line which is a little different), the higher the priority is in the sequence then it will over-ride all other lower priorities if its trigger condition is met. For example, if trigger 2 is met, then it will be the line running, even if triggers 1, 3, 4, and 5 are true. If trigger 3 is met, then it will be the line running, unless trigger 2 is already met, even if triggers 1, 4, and 5 are true. It is important to ensure you have your triggers in the correct sequence (particularly if you have built a strategy around a progression) to ensure they don’t interfere with each other and do something different than what you intend.
    Stable: Stormcloak
    Current Glads: Lachdanan (human war), Ecthelion (human war), Kedro (rage elaar), Acheros (war elaar), Tsiroth (war elaar)
    HOL Retirees: Rauthreygo (human war), Farkas (rage elaar), Vilkus (theatrics elaar), Thalvric (war elaar), Gamling (war dunder), Kresjack (theatrics elaar), Percivus (war spite), Agravaine (war elaar)

  7. #7
    Elite Master Adoede's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    511
    Thanks for the additions Stormcloak & Weaw. I've added them to the guide.
    Adoede | Tevrosin

  8. #8
    Aspiring Master FrosteeFyre's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Posts
    173
    Heyall, I've been noticing my DW-strategy guys get completely destroyed by defensive parry strategies and was wondering if there was a strategy that could get around this particular weakness? I've finagled with every strategy line possible and have had little to no positive results- is it simply impossible for an offensive DW glad to best a defensive parrying glad or is there something I could do differently that might tip the odds in my favour? It's okay if you don't want to answer, I wouldn't want you to spoil anything, only that I'm at the point where I've gone through nearly every strategy I can conceive to no avail. Thanks!
    ~Frostee~


    Stable: Frostee Fyre-

    Baratheonus, Snivlez, Doomedsoul, Godly Greg, Bloody Bill, Benevolent Ben, Raging Rick, Dangerous Dan

    ~Regular Gladiator, HoL Gladiator, Retired Gladiator~

  9. #9
    Aspiring Master Stormcloak's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    150
    Hey Frostee,

    It's hard to say without knowing the particulars of your glad. You have a bunch in Maximus and primus and it starts to become competitive in those brackets. Managers are looking to move up and sometimes you'll find Tom picking on Peter who's picking on Paul who's picking on Tom if they are having success challenging them. It's also tough because there can still be a wide gap between skills training too.
    There may be a few things you can do, either with your strategy, your build and equipment, or by just avoiding the build that gives you trouble.
    The most important thing is to review the fights and understand where it is that you're losing (while still minding where you are doing well). Is it always with one particular strategy line? Are you losing on endurance, or health, or either? Are you missing attacks or are they not hitting hard enough?
    If you want to discuss particulars without making it public, feel free to send me a private message and we can do that.
    Stable: Stormcloak
    Current Glads: Lachdanan (human war), Ecthelion (human war), Kedro (rage elaar), Acheros (war elaar), Tsiroth (war elaar)
    HOL Retirees: Rauthreygo (human war), Farkas (rage elaar), Vilkus (theatrics elaar), Thalvric (war elaar), Gamling (war dunder), Kresjack (theatrics elaar), Percivus (war spite), Agravaine (war elaar)

  10. #10
    Veteran Master weaw's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    340
    Quote Originally Posted by FrosteeFyre View Post
    Heyall, I've been noticing my DW-strategy guys get completely destroyed by defensive parry strategies and was wondering if there was a strategy that could get around this particular weakness?
    Sorry, i'm newbie here, but i'll try to give some answers. Just as i see.

    At first, there's some trouble to answer to You. It's not because anyone wouldn't want to do that. But because any gladiator has very and very own features.
    So, Adoede (for example) may have an answers for his DW-guys, but for Your DW-guys it wouldn't work fine.

    At second, there is a rushing strategies like berserk 10/8 in one line. Of course, it's works fine if Your gladiator have enough agility/stamina. But a stable managers having Primus are prepared to encounter that strategy. And You must be prepared to do something against. And they must be ... And so on. :)

    Third. It's looks like a destiny of Your gladiator is solved at the step of buying. It's really important which race You choose for him, his weapon, his attributes. It's not so obvious at low-level... How to choose well? Ok, You may read a guides (thanks for experienced players, who wrote it). But You must to get Your own experience to choose fine.
    And Your "...my DW-strategy guys get completely destroyed by defensive parry strategies..." perhaps just a way to choose more wisely next time.

    Quote Originally Posted by Adoede View Post
    6) Don’t be afraid to be extreme in your strategies
    As a tip...

    So, good luck to You. In the Pit.
    Last edited by weaw; 12-17-2014 at 04:43 AM.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •