New Update 7/29/2014: New Pit Fight Matchups, New Level Requirments For Skills & More

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Nate, by saying we can still slow play our warriors, your being completely disingenuous.

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Not disingenuous at all. I never make assumptions as to why players play PoW. Some players only play with one gladiator, some only use the rage specialty. I've seen some players run conquests all day while others run the gauntlet all day. I don't know why some favor one over the other, I can make an educated guess is all. We have some players who are only interested in fighting in the arena, and then we've had some who wanted to avoid the arena because they didn't fancy PvP but loved the idea of the Great Realm, the art work and the idea of leveling up a character. I've seen players only level their gladiators to level 10 or so before selling them and starting over time and time again. You would be surprised at the wide number of play styles I've seen. Were some players avoiding the arena and "slow leveling" because they enjoyed a slower pace and disliked the PVP? Sometimes yes, I've received messages from people about that before. Where some doing it to gain a skill advantage? Yes, we know that for sure. People play PoW for a lot of different reasons and I'm always getting new messages from players about some new idea or some off the wall thing I never imagined.

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We are near guaranteed to fail in the Pit, we can't effectively place & adjust the "extra" skills we have, and we now rocket up the charts for winning.

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I don't see this being the case. I think you'll find that gladiators will rise to their level of competitiveness and level off. I would expect the gladiators in question to eventually start taking on some losses for sure, but that is only because for so long the gladiators in question have been fighting gladiators far, far below their skill. I also expect they will continue to do quite well.

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NP is correct in pointing out that everyone else had the opportunity to play the same way and declined for whatever reason. SOTC ran his new HoL all the way to Blood God's in Pile Driver's lifetime, obviously his premium was on getting to end game. My premium was on stable record and winning in the Pits, and I learned how to do it from others who performed it fully without being villified.

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Please see my post to JerimyA5 as to why that assumption is incorrect. I recommend trying to not take anything personal. Nobody is pointing fingers, nobody is being vilified and nobody has been banned. A loophole in the game has been closed, that is all. It was done without any anger, malice or ill feelings. It was strictly a game design and business decision.

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While I agree the changes you make are best for the game, the way you go about it sucks. The 2 day warning you provided should have been 2 months. I would have been just as hot at other changes you've done if I had been directly affected by them. If i had wasted a huge amount of time (and potentially real dollars) fine tuning gear from endless Conquest runs only to have you bump the cap to 55 like you did I'm not sure I would be here typing this, I give the guys at the top credit for not blowing up on that one.

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A nice warning is great, I agree, however, I'm a one man team wearing multiple hats and juggling numerous tasks from biz dev, design, engineering, art, marketing, customer support, sys admin, janitor, etc. I don't think PoW will ever get a two months heads up on something. It's just how it is and how I work. I have a todo list and I do things as I have time and when I have time. I do my best to give a warning when possible though and I'll make an effort to offer an earlier warning in the future. Your frustration is noted, however, and reasonable. It should also be noted that PoW is always going to change and evolve as most games do these days. Players should expect this and not be surprised by it. Some players will be happy about the updates and some players will not. If I ever figure out how to make all players happy all of the time I'll write an instructional book about it, wait for it to hit the #1 best seller's list and retire to my newly purchased private island where I plan to clone dinosaurs and open a theme park. What could go wrong? ;)

Again, you have my sympathies and apologize for the frustration and grief this has caused you. If you would like to continue this discussion, send me a PM and I'll be happy to do so.

Good luck in the Pit!

-Nate-

I'll just chime in as well on the slow leveling and sandbagging pit fight thing.
Being one of the older players, I do remember that indeed was one area that was frowned upon, and there were min arena fight requirements to make sure glads are at least lvling somewhat in the old days specifically to discourage this.
I don't know when those original restrictions got left out in one of the many updates since, but I did notice it was viable to not lvl and just do tavern runs and hog pit fights again.
I've tried to get a few pit fight ranks for my newbie glad doing the same thing, but I am also aware this is likely an area that will be restricted again. Yes, some heads up ahead of time to warn the players involved to find a more 'healthy' style of play would have been nice and may have went down smoother than the anguish we are seeing now.

But for the players who are angry at this, you guys do have to see it from a meta game perspective and consider whether this is healthy for the game overall. Whilst your reasons for doing it may be perfectly legitimate to you, a few players sandbagging and slow lvling their glads is discouraging to other players and especially new players, who may find themselves outmatched without understanding why and get frustrated with the game and give up. Whilst you can make the argument "everyone can and/or should do this", I think we all know most players are not doing this, and I think everyone can understand a purposefully slow-leveled glad fighting a normally leveled glad is an unfair advantage.

I have been wondering where the larger fight totals were coming from since I haven't been getting an abnormal amount of fight tokens. Hadn't considered the difference in fight queue. That would explain why my team suddenly shot up in ranking after the ratings change. I do agree with apoc that instituting such a change mid season is disruptive.

Also the reward for kills has been, in my view, devalued. I'd much rather have an arena token vs. 1 trophy (1/40) of an old trophy. The thrill of chaining kills has also been lost as well.

P.s. Did anyone ever get that issue where you'd make a kill on your first fight of the day while you had eight trophies, but afterwards your trophy total would be 7 instead of 8?

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Originally Posted by Nate

the recent update did not affect the Blood Gods algorithm at all.

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I was not aware of this. I take back my grievances on that as it is totally unfounded :P

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Originally Posted by Sotc

I have been wondering where the larger fight totals were coming from since I haven't been getting an abnormal amount of fight tokens. Hadn't considered the difference in fight queue. That would explain why my team suddenly shot up in ranking after the ratings change. I do agree with apoc that instituting such a change mid season is disruptive.

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Rating algorithm hasnt changed, but Ahhnold's w/l has dropped as difficult opponents have upgraded their gear, and I stopped earning fight tokens from kills. Your glads have had their w/l stay the same for the most part. Ahhnold dropped 2%. It took me a bit to work out the extra fights though. At first I thought it was because your guys were outside the top 10 and you were getting extra fights from trophies in the good old start of season scramble. As the season progressed and none of us could get extra fights though, I noticed that you were still getting way more fights. I spoke to Nate and he told me that Fight Token drops had been reduced somewhat, and as I started doing tavern fights again, I knew that that wasnt a difference between your stable and mine. I then settled on the fight que difference, but it wasnt an issue as kills had been earning me enough fight tokens to stay in front till recently.

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Originally Posted by Sotc

Also the reward for kills has been, in my view, devalued. I'd much rather have an arena token vs. 1 trophy (1/40) of an old trophy. The thrill of chaining kills has also been lost as well.

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I agree that kills feel very devalued now. If they gave an even bigger boost to ratings, it would feel ok to no longer get the fight token. Nate has said that he hasnt changed the BG rating algorithm, but maybe it is something he will change at the start of next season?

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Originally Posted by Sotc

P.s. Did anyone ever get that issue where you'd make a kill on your first fight of the day while you had eight trophies, but afterwards your trophy total would be 7 instead of 8?

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Never had the unawarded token issue afaik

Avengelyn & Jerimy - Sorry to hear about your troubles with your previous style of play. I never had the patience to do that myself...

I hope you guys can come around to moving towards the end-game in blood gods because, to me, that is the best part of this game. Regardless if you get there slowly or quickly, blood gods is where Pit of War really comes into its own with all the build/gear/tactical strategies that come into play. The only difference between getting there slowly or quickly will be your glads overall record in the arena...which you'll see quickly becomes nearly meaningless in the blood gods season. You're so hopelessly outmatched in gear when you first get to blood gods that your sparkling 80%+ win/loss quickly becomes an overall 40% win/loss percentage. Maybe you buck the trend and your glads are competitive from the get-go. Still, the only ranking that matters in blood gods is your current season rank relative to your peers.

Blood gods can be great fun if you can figure out tactics and triggers that work and build your gear/strategies accordingly (we've lost a few managers who never could adapt their strategies from the regular game to the hyper-competitive environment of blood gods.)

Best of luck to ya and hope to see you in blood gods soon :cool:

Dont forget the Blood Games :) You know your opponent 24hrs in advance so you have a full day to tweak your strategy to get the best shot at winning that match. Takes patience and dedication, which I think may be up your alley.


...I'm lazy and just go with "hit and hope" :P

One final thing I would like to say regarding the game in general and than I ask all future discussion on this topic be handled via PM is, I am unable to anticipate all possible outcomes a player might do. If you ever find yourself doing something that feels like it may be a loophole, please send me a message and ask if it is ok to do whatever it is you had in mind, I promise I won't bite. If you get my blessing on it, go ahead and tear up the arena with it. If you don't talk to me and it it turns out to be a loophole, you stand to lose a lot of work because it will get corrected and I don't enjoy upsetting people and making people unhappy, I really truly don't.

Now would be a great time to send me questions if you are currently doing anything or planning on doing something you *think* might not be ok. If you have the slightest feeling it might not be considered cool, please for the love of the Blood Gods and their newly purchased puppy Patches, ask me now. :)

I ask you all to remember I'm a one man band and I will never be able to water proof the game 100%. I will do my best, but I leave it up to everyone to play the game according to the "spirit" of the game, not the "letter" of game meaning "if the game lets me do it, it must be ok", sometimes that may be true, other times it may not. I think for the majority of things it is very obvious but for those times when it is not and you are unsure if something is ok to do, just ask me. I'm actually a really nice guy despite what the media says about me! ;)

Thanks again for your understanding and feedback, I appreciate it.

Good luck in the Pit!

-Nate-

I don't disagree at all that the endgame would be the best part. That's true of any good game imo. And POW is a very good game. I did in fact have 2 glads in Blood Gods. Getting their brains stomped into the sands daily. And I very much looked forward to learning what it takes to slow the rate at which they were getting trounced. lol

I loved the early parts of the game as well however, and have never liked rushing to the endgame as most players seem to in most games. I prefer to take my time, enjoy and do my best in all aspects of the game, not just the one part everyone else likes. Nate clearly doesn't like that however. It seems he feels that players that do their best in any aspect of the game besides just the end are disruptive and undesirable. I have no wish to disrupt or unbalance the game so I'm just going to move on. My stable has already been reset and this will be my last post on this forum. I shouldn't be clogging it up if I'm not even playing any longer.

Thanks for all the facetious responses Nate. It makes leaving easier. lol

Best of luck to you all in the Pits!!!

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I leave it up to everyone to play the game according to the "spirit" of the game, not the "letter" of game meaning "if the game lets me do it, it must be ok"

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Ill just make a brief statement on this, in a game i will always play by the letter until told otherwise, i just dont feel I got any obligation to judge whats the spirit of the game.

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Originally Posted by Nate

One final thing I would like to say regarding the game in general and than I ask all future discussion on this topic be handled via PM is, I am unable to anticipate all possible outcomes a player might do. If you ever find yourself doing something that feels like it may be a loophole, please send me a message and ask if it is ok to do whatever it is you had in mind, I promise I won't bite. If you get my blessing on it, go ahead and tear up the arena with it. If you don't talk to me and it it turns out to be a loophole, you stand to lose a lot of work because it will get corrected and I don't enjoy upsetting people and making people unhappy, I really truly don't.

Now would be a great time to send me questions if you are currently doing anything or planning on doing something you *think* might not be ok. If you have the slightest feeling it might not be considered cool, please for the love of the Blood Gods and their newly purchased puppy Patches, ask me now. :)

I ask you all to remember I'm a one man band and I will never be able to water proof the game 100%. I will do my best, but I leave it up to everyone to play the game according to the "spirit" of the game, not the "letter" of game meaning "if the game lets me do it, it must be ok", sometimes that may be true, other times it may not. I think for the majority of things it is very obvious but for those times when it is not and you are unsure if something is ok to do, just ask me. I'm actually a really nice guy despite what the media says about me! ;)

Thanks again for your understanding and feedback, I appreciate it.

Good luck in the Pit!

-Nate-

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Nate,

I’d really like some public confirmation in regards to your post because I feel threatened by it, and I think others may be as well. Within this thread you referred to what me and some others did as a loophole, and in this last post you seem to indicate that if another loophole is exploited that you would not only fix the loophole, but punish the persons performing it, which has me a tad concerned since I fully intend to force you to change the game several more times, as a matter of gamesmanship not some evil intent. By that I mean that I don’t feel obligated to tell you how I intend to gain a strategic advantage before actually gaining said advantage, since that would defeat the payoff of the strategy.

I’ve already brought up to you in this post my concerns about the Pit matches being against the same warrior repeatedly, and you sort of shrugged it off, albeit with a threat. My best friend runs Team Triangle and Soul Maidens, and right now some of my lower level “sandbaggers” are Pit locked against his “sandbaggers” and he is getting the worst of it right now. Fortunately or unfortunately, his warriors, despite being lower level than mine are nonetheless able to defeat mine enough so mine don’t win the Pit challenge, but what if that were to change in the future? We have already had a discussion with each other about being very careful of how we handle our strategies so that we won’t be accused of collusion in this situation, and I just told you that we are friends so now everyone knows.

As another example, the void created by North Point’s deletion of his warriors, Piledriver now fights 2 different 90+ skilled warriors, one of which is a few levels above him, and the other a full 10 levels above him, however, it does appear that they are inferior to Piledriver at this time, so I suspect he will win most if not all of the matchups. Is this something I should be concerned about? I mean the guy has more skills than me and is 10 levels higher, and it’s a function of a nerf of your creation, so am I right in believing I’m “in the clear” on that example?

Long story short, you’ve addressed what you perceived to be a loophole in the game, and so now there WILL be another “superior” way to win not only in the Pits, but in all areas of the game which I fully intend to find. I see it as no different that when the Agility dual wielders dominated the top of the game vs the 2h weapon warriors, and thus you rebalanced the game to address it. To my knowledge those managers that skewed the game in their favor by stacking agility wrote that off as good strategy and I would surely agree. In most all games there is a superior strategy, and those strategies change as the game is changed to address them. We aren’t talking about someone hacking into the website or something of that nature, policy on those kinds of thing don’t warrant discussion.

You obviously keep a very close eye on your game, and are willing to change it without notice, so I guess what I’m inquiring about is why threaten the players for implementing sound strategy (beyond a change to game mechanics) to dominate a sector of the game?

If you would please clarify your feelings on the above I’d greatly appreciate it so I can go about having fun playing the game knowing whether or not this anvil over my head is real or just an illusion.

Thanks in advance,

Avengelyn, Manager of Lethal Formula