Black Market Thoughts

[Team Kaos]

For the amount of trophies some peeps are blowing on Energy Potions I hope the reward fits the expenditure.

I also have seen 2 pretty dominating gladiators, at least that my guys have had a difficult time with.

I have seen a gladiator swinging a 2 handed ball and chain....is that weapon available through the armory? Because that one doesn't show up in mine...i get offered a great sword, great axe and maul.

[Werelion]

It's kind of funny that the best records (on a percentage basis) are not likely to win the contest. It'll be won by whoever has the most real world dollars to blow on potions.....even if the actual gladiator is subpar.

[Adam C]

You could also make the point that whoever has the most time in one day to continually fight could just as easily get to the top. I'll cop to buying my way up there today. I wouldnt do it again though.

[Team Kaos]

More thoughts flowing.

The result that we are seeing halfway through the day is of a particular manager(s) pumping trophies into Energy Potions to maintain the most wins and therefore remain the top seed...isn't that the exact opposite of why everyone pleaded for such matches. To eliminate the trophy spending managers from gaining the advantage by "buying" wins?
Wouldn't it make more sense to base the leader board by winning % rather then wins? And based on matches fought daily, group the gladiators accordingly. Basically you would group gladiators that battled between 1-10 matches, 11-20, 21-30 and so forth or some something comparable...so you don't get managers that fight a warrior once get a win and call it quits for a 100% win/loss on the day.

[Dainoji]

Team Kaos, how did I know you'd be the first to post your thoughts, and your thoughts would be of a whinny nature. I popped on a little after two o'clock in the morning after last night's turn and the pit fights were running, so they've been up for almost twelve hours. With the number of fights some people have now no potions would be required if they work in front of a computer all day and just hit the fight button every ten minutes. Funny you should mention dominating gladiators, but I guess when they aren't yours its different, right? As far as I can tell you aren't wearing armory items, if you were their durability would be infinite which it is not, so they are just crappy gray items.

Werelion, what should the best records be based on? Percentage? So if I fight one time and go 1-0-0 I'll have 100%, should I now be the winner?

Nate, love the pit fights, now I can have my fix anytime I want, thanks for that! Any time frame on when Jimmy's shop will open up?

[Adam C]

Yeah, thats a good thought. Even easier, but somehow less rewarding, would be to have everyone who wants to fight "enter" the fighters group for that day, then they all fight each other the same amount of times in an automated fashion. Say the fights start every 15 minutes, so there are 96 fights a day. Then you can use best win percentage.

[Werelion]

I currently have two fighters that have won 4x more fights than they've lost with one having over 40 wins but there's noway I'll finish in the top three unless I gulp down potions non-stop. A scale ranking fighters by win percentage based on number of fights fought would be nice to see. It would also be nice to 'win' by having the best gladiator or best strategy and not the biggest wallet (and yes I've contributed a few dollars to the Power Chamber). The fighting pretty much whenver part is fun however and I'm looking foreward to the balck market store.

[Werelion]

Another thought based on Adam's post. A double elimination tourney (with base equipment) set on character level would be very cool and equitable across the board.

[Dainoji]

Why are you guys assuming people are buying potions? Just hit the button every ten minutes and you'll rack up fights and you still have to win those fights to have a chance of being in the top, and those wins come from your strategy and gladiator build, not your gear, and that is what some people were bitching about. But I guess with that problem solved we all need a new issue to bitch about. The way I see the current set up is free players can spend their TIME to try and get to the top and win prizes without spending real world dollars and paying players can spend their trophies to try and get to the top if they don't want to spend their time, seems like a good deal for both sides if you ask me. There is also the gold cost associated with these fights and how long before a manager runs out if they do 100 or more fights per day or decides to back off so they can save up for something.

[Team Kaos]

Personally, I couldn't care how many trophies you pump into today's matches or how many hours you have stared into a computer screen.
But the point of the armory only matches was for people to get a better idea of who had the best pure fighters...not who could accumulate the most wins.

I have 3 guys that sit 1-2-3 at the top of where it counts on the leader board.

But to each his own.

By the way I also have the gladiator with the best record in the black market matches today.........




Werelion, what should the best records be based on? Percentage? So if I fight one time and go 1-0-0 I'll have 100%, should I now be the winner?


Wouldn't it make more sense to base the leader board by winning % rather then wins? And based on matches fought daily, group the gladiators accordingly. Basically you would group gladiators that battled between 1-10 matches, 11-20, 21-30 and so forth or some something comparable...so you don't get managers that fight a warrior once get a win and call it quits for a 100% win/loss on the day

[Adam C]

OOO... double elimination, that sounds awesome.

I know people seem to have a problem with buying your way to victory, but all these fights at a cost of 2 points each have been helping me hone my fight strategies. Its cheaper than the tavern energy wise. Plus, you only get one shot to be the first black market champion!

[Dainoji]

I have 3 guys that sit 1-2-3 at the top of where it counts on the leader board.

Spoken like someone not in the top three at the Black Market "Where it counts" for those interested in the Black Market.


By the way I also have the gladiator with the best record in the black market matches today.........

Not according to Jimmy you don't.

[Team Kaos]

There is also the gold cost associated with these fights and how long before a manager runs out if they do 100 or more fights per day or decides to back off so they can save up for something.

100 fights = being available for 10+ hours on and off during the course of the day. I think the vast majority of people have jobs or go to school, sleep on occasion, and eat among other life responsibilities.

[Team Kaos]

Spoken like someone not in the top three at the Black Market "Where it counts" for those interested in the Black Market.

I could take the bait and just drop about 100 trophies and turn the whole thing into a joke..but I believe that is the complete opposite of what was trying to be built here.

[Adam C]

So, with the Black Market Fights, Its just Base Stats and random low level equipment? What about Skill Points? Are they base too?

[Dainoji]

100 fights = being available for 10+ hours on and off during the course of the day. I think the vast majority of people have jobs or go to school, sleep on occasion, and eat among other life responsibilities.

Hey, if someone wants to spend 10+ hours so be it, who are you or me or anyone for that matter to tell someone how to spend their time, they don't tell us how to spend our money, right?


I could take the bait and just drop about 100 trophies and turn the whole thing into a joke..but I believe that is the complete opposite of what was trying to be built here.

Sure, and how many days in a row are you going to do that? Every day? Doubtful. Once the dust settles I think this is going to be a great boon for newbies to learn how to play and a great way for free players to try and win some nice items by spending their time and not money, and yes, for the occasional paying player who wants to be on top, they can spend trophies and try and get to the top that way but they aren't going to do it every day unless the prizes are crazy amazing, because it would be easier to just got buy them instead.


So, with the Black Market Fights, Its just Base Stats and random low level equipment? What about Skill Points? Are they base too?

As far as I can tell my gladiators still have their skills, base stats and random gray quality items.

[Team Kaos]

No, it seems skill points are used as normal. That is the reason you are fighting gladiators within a given level range of your own gladiator.

[Team Kaos]

Like i said, unless purple or gold gear comes flowing from the black market, spending trophies seems the complete opposite of what these match ups were intended for. If it takes someone 100 fights to hone a gladiators strategy or tactics....they have bigger issues.

[Adam C]

I am definitely not fighting guys within my own range. Im a level 21 with a total of less than 40 skill points. Im fighting guys 8 levels higher with over 80 skill points. Somehow, the whole base stats thing seems lessened when everyone is running bonuses from skill points too.

[Warmonger]

I was very tempted to go nuts and try to win it just out of curiosity on the prize since I don't know if the eventual winner will reveal what he got. But with it ending when it does I'm not getting up early enough to try it. Though I have dropped several trophies because it is kinda cool to play with. It would be nice to see a cap on fights, even if it's something pretty high just so the best manager/warrior wins, not the guy who hit the button the most times. Perhaps Nate has multiple types of tournaments planned.

[Dainoji]

Like i said, unless purple or gold gear comes flowing from the black market, spending trophies seems the complete opposite of what these match ups were intended for. If it takes someone 100 fights to hone a gladiators strategy or tactics....they have bigger issues.

I dunno, seems to me one of the chief complaints people had when I first started playing was they wanted more to do, they wanted to fight anytime they felt like it. Well, now they can do that. I'll disagree with you on the 100 fights to hone your strategies comment. You are an old DM player with years of experience with these types of games under your belt, many new players never played this kind of game before, so I'd venture to say it took you 100s of fights to attain the level of skill you have as a manager in these types of games and now new players can rapidly get fights under their belts as well.

[Team Kaos]

I am definitely not fighting guys within my own range. Im a level 21 with a total of less than 40 skill points. Im fighting guys 8 levels higher with over 80 skill points. Somehow, the whole base stats thing seems lessened when everyone is running bonuses from skill points too.

I know I have not fought anyone under a level 28 thus far.



I'll disagree with you on the 100 fights to hone your strategies comment. You are an old DM player with years of experience with these types of games under your belt, many new players never played this kind of game before,

I can sort of agree with that, but this isn't DM, it has it's own formula's and rolls resulting in it's own quirky outcomes, but your right that a new player has a lot to experience to understand all the different mix and match attributes.skills and strategies among other things.

[Adam C]

I'm not sure, but I think Kills count for ranking. I have 1 less win, but 2 more kills, and I am ahead.

[Warmonger]

The ranking system is weird at least for the normal arena. Just take a look at the team rankings. The Meatbags are directly below a team that they are better than in wins, losses, winning %, kills AND total fights yet are somehow still behind them. So it must take something else into account. Maybe quality of opponents?

[Dainoji]

I am definitely not fighting guys within my own range. Im a level 21 with a total of less than 40 skill points. Im fighting guys 8 levels higher with over 80 skill points. Somehow, the whole base stats thing seems lessened when everyone is running bonuses from skill points too.

I haven't fought anyone more than three levels higher than me.

[Hammock]

Overall I like the Blackmarket fights...
I love fights with Grey Equipment.

But overall it feels like this one incarnation of the fights is trying to do too much.. Rewards are cool but those really just boil down to who wants to spend the most trophies.

I think the best/quick fix (until more divisions/styles of daily fights show up) would be limit the number of fights that a fighter can do in a day.
Even something as high as a 50 fight limit would be fine... Something like that would be a good middle ground I think.

-L

[Dainoji]

The ranking system is weird at least for the normal arena. Just take a look at the team rankings. The Meatbags are directly below a team that they are better than in wins, losses, winning %, kills AND total fights yet are somehow still behind them. So it must take something else into account. Maybe quality of opponents?

I think your opponent matters, or the results of the fights matters. I see bigger jumps or falls in the rankings when I dominate or get dominated in the fight as opposed to just squeaking out a victory. Not sure if that is how things work in the Black Market though.

[Jaradakar]

I posted this in suggestions, as I did not see this thread:

Likes

-I love that it's a great place to test strategies out.
-I love that we're all in grey gear.

Dislikes

-Manager with the most free time has a huge advantage.
-Manager with the deepest pockets has a huge advantage (more energy = more fights).

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I really feel like each gladiator should have an overall limit per day of how many times they can fight in the black market. Maybe something like 20 total fights per day?

Then your wins or losses would also have more meaning, people who don't have all day to place fights have a better chance, and people who have loads of trophies can't out energy those who don't.

[Adam C]

I think a fight cap is a great idea. You can only really fight 6 fights an hour anyway without using potions, and you'll start each day with your 20 energy, which is 10 fights. I dont think free time is as big a factor as deep pockets are. I bought my way to the top today. But so what? How many guys on the top of the ladders have bought and paid for armor and weapons. I guess I'll find out if it was worth it.

[Jaradakar]

I think a fight cap is a great idea. You can only really fight 6 fights an hour anyway without using potions, and you'll start each day with your 20 energy, which is 10 fights.

Interesting here you agree ;-)



I dont think free time is as big a factor as deep pockets are. I bought my way to the top today. But so what? How many guys on the top of the ladders have bought and paid for armor and weapons. I guess I'll find out if it was worth it.

But your closing statement does not ;-)

But don't you see? That's the problem. We already have an arena to show off how deep someones pockets are. I thought that part of the point of putting us in grey gear was to even the playing field a bit and give us an avenue to see who would come out on top without money being as much of a factor.

Granted, I can see people might start just pumping up there base statistics with trophies, which would then put us back to the whole whoever has the deeper pockets but at least that gets stupid expensive very fast.

[Werelion]

Some good ideas being thrown out. Limited number of total fights per day. Keep fighting until you reach x losses in a day and winner is the one with most wins. Any others?

[Team Kaos]

Some good ideas being thrown out. Limited number of total fights per day. Keep fighting until you reach x losses in a day and winner is the one with most wins. Any others?

I guess it all depends on what the underground fights are meant to represent. Gladiator skill and attribute combined with the managers strategy or deep pockets and/or time spent clicking the fight button.

Personally, I like the elimination method best. Once a gladiator losses 5 or 10 times in a day, that's it he's done fighting for the day and the top 3 with the most wins ..win.



The more and more I think of the black market the harder time I am having understanding it. You can receive awards and prizes for finishing top 3 each day...but the top 3 of each ladder in the arena from fresh meat to champions where the records are kept, you can receive injuries and even die and suffer from death sickness for a duration and as of yet they don't receive anything.

[Adam C]

Interesting here you agree ;-)



But your closing statement does not ;-)

But don't you see? That's the problem. We already have an arena to show off how deep someones pockets are. I thought that part of the point of putting us in grey gear was to even the playing field a bit and give us an avenue to see who would come out on top without money being as much of a factor.

Granted, I can see people might start just pumping up there base statistics with trophies, which would then put us back to the whole whoever has the deeper pockets but at least that gets stupid expensive very fast.

I'm saying that I do think the cap is a great idea. But right now there is no cap, so someone can just keep fighting as long as they can buy the potions. Since rank is determined by how many victories you have, the more fights you fight the better. Truth be told, I only bought the trophies so I could re-equip all my guys, and upgrade my stable. When I started the Black Market Pit fight, I just kept going and going, figuring maybe the first prize from the BM would be something cool and different.Tomorrow is another day, and I'm sure the results will vary as to how that plays out. Whats cool, is that everyday the top people will win something, and from what I understand, all participants get credit towards new items from the BM.

[Dainoji]

Maybe the goal of the black market is to just give people something to do at any point during the day and give managers the satisfaction of knowing their gladiators can beat another one in a fair fight, after all that is what all the bitching and complaining was about by certain managers. I mean, you don't even know what the prizes are for Christ's sake, maybe its a big stick in the eye or a punch in the balls! Would you all bitch then that the guy with the most wins, "wins"? Anyone who would like to win a kick in the nuts let me know and I'll see if I can make it happen!

Also a lot of assumptions are flying around and there are 365 days in the year and every day is a new day at the black market, and unless the prizes are over the top managers who spend money are going to just go and buy their gear instead of waiting for some mystery prize and based on what has been mentioned about Jimmy's shop I imagine that the main purpose for the black market will be to earn whatever it is we will be earning so we can use it at his shop.

I just went back and re-read the announcement and the first sentence says Jimmy is awarding the top three gladiators with prizes as part of a promotion, maybe once the promotion is over there won't even be prizes, just bragging rights!

Jimmy the Squid just announced his underground pit fights are up and running and to promote this momentous occasion he is offering awesome prizes to the top three gladiators each day!

Today the market is new so everyone is eager to jump on it, in a week or two you might stroll over and not find it very active and find yourself in the top three at the end of the day and win a prize, that is if prizes are still being given out, so sit back, take a Valium, and relax.

[Team Kaos]

300 wins...and words of advice....don't try it...it's pointless, time consuming and and utterly not fun at all. My thumb hurts from clicking, but someone had to come out on top. And Agregothe and his 123rd ranking wasn't gonna be the guy.

If tonight didn't prove at how silly the most wins format is....I'm not sure what will.

Sorry Adam....guess you caught me on a bad day. That is unless you feel a second wind coming on in the wee hours to pump out a few more wins.

[Adam C]

I couldnt even if I wanted to. My fight button wont work anymore. I can get maybe a fight or two out of it if I take a tavern quest first. You can say what you want about my guy being 123rd, but I had a chance to really refine his fight strategies. I guess second will have to do though. I can see why you would want the best prize with your lack of quality weaponry/armor and all. Congrats.

Problem Located: I was out of gold. Figured I would fight up to your 392 matches to see what the final W/L ratio was. Went 2 over and took the lead.

[Apoca1ypse]

seem like today there is a points based format. seems good :D



edit: ok, so i had a quick go with characters ranged from lvl 28 to joombie lvl 2's. amusingly, the lvl 2's did the best :D

the more i think about it, the more i like the format. it really does make you think about "to i risk going for one more" as it will take 3 wins to balance out a loss. not only that, but it looks like the setup will change every day, or couple of days. i really dig this because it will keep things interesting, and different rules will be able to cater to everyone's tastes at one point or another :D

[Dainoji]

I couldnt even if I wanted to. My fight button wont work anymore. I can get maybe a fight or two out of it if I take a tavern quest first. You can say what you want about my guy being 123rd, but I had a chance to really refine his fight strategies. I guess second will have to do though. I can see why you would want the best prize with your lack of quality weaponry/armor and all. Congrats.

Problem Located: I was out of gold. Figured I would fight up to your 392 matches to see what the final W/L ratio was. Went 2 over and took the lead.

You sneaky bastard! Hahaha! I was enjoying your guys little race to the top and you then pulled the "ouch! my leg hurts I'm pulling out of the race routine" and suckered ole Kaos into going to sleep with dreams of his #1 position safe and secure. I'm sure Jimmy would be proud of your sniping tactic! :) Congrats!

[Dainoji]

seem like today there is a points based format. seems good

Yes, I agree, very cool. I wonder if each day is going to be different or if there is some kind of schedule. Either way it would certainly keep things fresh and interesting. Hmmm, now for the tough decision, do I hit the fight button or stick with my current score...this is a tough one as you pointed out a loss really hurts!

[Apoca1ypse]

yeah, i really like this :D now i'm torn between using energy on underground fights asap, or wait to do tavern work to get skill points.


...impatience is winning hahha



also, what did the top 3 people get for yesterday's fights?

[Apoca1ypse]

this deserves it's own post, not an edited in foot note:

Nate, the change to BM is brilliant. Really digging it :D

[crow]

Nate,
Really enjoying the Black Market and looking forward to the Squid's grand opening of his shop. I see that the pit has peaked alot of interest from everyone. Since so many of us are spending more time on the site, it would be great if you could put a chat board liked we talked about a few months back.

[crow]

Well my boy Summit, came in 4th and a long way from 3rd!! I gave him a pat on his sore back for the effort!!!

[Team Kaos]

You sneaky bastard! Hahaha! I was enjoying your guys little race to the top and you then pulled the "ouch! my leg hurts I'm pulling out of the race routine" and suckered ole Kaos into going to sleep with dreams of his #1 position safe and secure. I'm sure Jimmy would be proud of your sniping tactic! Congrats!

Like I said, unless he wanted to make that wee hours last push. Solstice was awarded with pretty much what was spent not including gold unless you use pre 1/2 off pricing..then it would be a a push.

Oh yeah...apparently you cannot enter the BM matches if you place 1-3 the prior day. Just for info


Much better format today.

Nice job...to everyone in getting things busy in the Pit again.

[Hammock]

Yes... A really nice change to the format here.. I like that Nate can change the formula easily however he wants.

Solid stuff.

[Dainoji]

Oh yeah...apparently you cannot enter the BM matches if you place 1-3 the prior day. Just for info

Interesting. That's actually pretty cool though. How long before you can fight again?

[Team Kaos]

Oh yeah...apparently you cannot enter the BM matches if you place 1-3 the prior day. Just for info

Interesting. That's actually pretty cool though. How long before you can fight again?

"Sorry kid, your stable won yesterday and is already old news! Come back tomorrow and I'll let you in again. Cheer up! Uncle Jimmy still loves you!"

Straight from Jimmy il Calamari

[Jaradakar]

"Sorry kid, your stable won yesterday and is already old news! Come back tomorrow and I'll let you in again. Cheer up! Uncle Jimmy still loves you!"

Straight from Jimmy il Calamari

I like this and the change with losses count as -3. This is much much cooler now!

[Apoca1ypse]

really likeing the format today. it's letting my sub lvl 10 guy compete with the top glads :D (4th place at the typing of this)

[Dainoji]

really likeing the format today. it's letting my sub lvl 10 guy compete with the top glads :D (4th place at the typing of this)

As far as I can tell you are matched up with guys around your level, so the format isn't making it any easier for your lower level guys to do well. I think that is another big difference here in Jimmy's pits, level and arena rank don't mean anything.

[crow]

This has been a great training tool for improving fight strategy.

[crow]

I'm been wanting to know what the winners from yesterday won?

[Apoca1ypse]

As far as I can tell you are matched up with guys around your level, so the format isn't making it any easier for your lower level guys to do well. I think that is another big difference here in Jimmy's pits, level and arena rank don't mean anything.

that's what i like. it's been balanced out so that the little guys have a shot at taking out the title :D

[Team Kaos]

Solstice received a nice purple for #2 spot

[Adam C]

Agregothe got a nice purple as well. Nothing super amazing, but a good prize nonetheless.

Back into the Pit today, and noticing the -10 for getting a kill. Thats going to make it hard to climb back to the top.

[drachir379]

Kills knocked out 2 of my glads.

[Dainoji]

Kills knocked out 2 of my glads.

Indeed! Trying to not kill someone is proving more difficult than I thought! Loving the variety Nate and the whole pit fight format in general. As of right now I don't recognize any of the gladiators in the top 10 which must make them happy to have their name in lights, even if only briefly! I think I'm out for today because of my kills, but alas, tomorrow is a new day with a new challenge!

[Arkham]

That means if you kill someone, and not if you are killed? I need to learn to read :)

[Arkham]

And then Horror killed someone and dropped from 2nd to 34th. I see :)

[CaineDeSoulis]

i'm having alot of fun watching gladiators climb the ranks after shade and then losing one and climbing again and then dissappearing with a kill lol. Shade is lvl 2 and unranked :/

[Team Kaos]

Shade is lvl 2 and unranked

What level gladiators are you facing?

[CaineDeSoulis]

shade is facing levels 1-5 my other 4 tested gladiators killed people >.<. my question is if winning first is only going to net me a lvl 2 purple and thats it. i'll drop out of the running for it :/

[Team Kaos]

I highly doubt you will get anything better then the current level your gladiator is ranked.

[CaineDeSoulis]

no trophies or even gold for the win :(?

[Warmonger]

I have won 1st and 3rd now and both times it was a very good purple of similar quality. One I used and one I did not. I guess the value depends on how much you have to spend to take it. Both times it was a piece of armor equivalent to what my guy was wearing normally. I don't have enough data to know if that was coincidence or you always get something fitting to your winner's style. I'd say yesterday it was worth the effort, since nobody was going crazy to win the loser's tourney and I was home all day doing a fantasy baseball draft anyway. :) Meric (Being a mediocre statistic having theatrics) was pretty easy to set up to "win". He would have gone without a single win had I not reequipped him for the 2nd arena fight of the day and forgot he was equipped when I sent him back to the tourney (Even then he still almost managed to lose).

[Team Kaos]

The BM tourney is a great new addition, BUT...the one thing that makes it a little bit of a crapshoot at times is the random order that weapons are issued. IMO I think to put it on a complete level field, would be to pit the gladiators using the same weapon type, lets say blades...that they both use the same one. For instance a dagger vs a dagger, opposed to the randomness of a Dagger going up vs a Bastard Sword.

Of course when a blade is facing an axe wielding foe it wouldn't matter but when facing an opponent within the same weapon specialty it would be much more skill vs skill if they had to battle with the same weapons opposed to at times weapon choice affecting the outcome.

[Nate]

As always thanks for all the feedback! With all new features there is an adjustment period and massaging is done until things settle into place. The goal of the pit fights is to give everyone something do anytime they want, while at the same time chasing a prize. Once Jimmy's shop is opened all participating gladiators will begin to accrue credits with each fight and then be able to use those credits towards items sold by Jimmy. These items will be different than the Blacksmith, and will become one of the main reasons you fight in the pits. There is no date set yet as Jimmy is still procuring his inventory but is working with great haste to bring you the best the Great Realm has to offer.

As time goes on different fight formats will be introduced, some will have fight caps, some will not, as we try and cater to as many play styles as possible. If some formats favor those with more time or trophies, then rest assured one will pop up that doesn't. Patience young grasshoppers! :)

As an aside, the concept of "seasons" in the regular arena are in the works where every X months records will reset with prizes awarded, and those prizes will of course be much bigger since it takes a lot more time to achieve. The overall rankings will still be kept of course, the season records will be their own separate area for players to compete in and start fresh every so often to keep things fun and exciting.

Good luck in the pits!

-Nate-

[Arkham]

The BM is tough on us east coasters. Last night I went to sleep in first and second with a 50-60 fight margin. I awoke to no presents.

That 5 am cut off means I won't be winning (unless that 5 pm error happens again).

[Warmonger]

Heh, I know what you mean, I'm East Coast also and it's bitten me a few times already.

[Nate]

I'll look into some options to help make it easier on EST vs PST, etc.

-Nate-

[Morvaane]

Sweet Im away for a while and black market gets opened, very nice! looking forward to catching on, looks like its rather cool... and im glad I missed the opening ceremony controversies lol

[Limpy]

For those that are bitching about the Black Market being unfair to those players who do not spend real money. I have not spent a dime on the game, purposefully so. Yesterday I came in 3rd and took home a nice purple item for my troubles. I think Nate is on the right track with these fights and has made adjustments for the betterment of the game, and I am positive he will continue to do so.

You will always get a lot further with honey than you will with vinegar. Just sayin'

[Lunarion199]

Hey today's fight formula was win=2, loss=-1, kill=-5, Fight Cap = 40 Fights. And I played 42 fights (32-4-6), 1st ranked so far, but it's still allowing me to fight though the fight cap has already been exceeded. Any help? I won't be able to play any more for today. Thanks!

[Limpy]

you have only fought 36 fights Lumarion. Kills do not count as extra fights, they are just additional outcomes. So 6 of your 36 fights have ended in you killing someone. Essentially a kill is worth -3 points as you get the +2 for a win.

[Lunarion199]

ok thanks!!

[CaineDeSoulis]

yay shade takes 1st again ^_^

[Apparition]

Is it just my guys or are rage fighters just better in the black market than other fighters? My 2 rage guys do very well but my other guys can only seem to win about 50% of the time. It would be nice to know if this is what everyone is seeing or if I need to work on the strategys of my non-rage guys...

[Lunarion199]

Hi Nate, today the black market is showig the fight cap as 25 fights but once we click pit fights it shows the cap as 40 fights. could you please check it out. Thanks

[Team Kaos]

Is it just my guys or are rage fighters just better in the black market than other fighters? My 2 rage guys do very well but my other guys can only seem to win about 50% of the time. It would be nice to know if this is what everyone is seeing or if I need to work on the strategys of my non-rage guys...

Gladiator carrying a big weapon that always gets the first hit every round vs an opponent with weak armor and add on multiple aggressive skills that ratchet up the damage and its a recipe to dominate unless the opponent can do a lot of dodging. And without bonus armor there are no skills to raise the opponents dodge or block outside of create distance.

[Dainoji]

Is it just my guys or are rage fighters just better in the black market than other fighters? My 2 rage guys do very well but my other guys can only seem to win about 50% of the time. It would be nice to know if this is what everyone is seeing or if I need to work on the strategys of my non-rage guys...

My theatrics gladiator always does better than my rage gladiator, if I had to take a guess I'd say most of the managers who run predominantly war and theatrics gladiators have to figure out new strategies for the black market since they don't have their equipment to help out anymore whereas rage gladiators have one speed whether they are in the arena or the pit fights so few or no changes are really required on the managers part to do well.

[Warmonger]

I dunno. I've had good success with my War guys in the black market. My rage guy is doing fine too. Meric (My only theatrics until he had an...accident) got his ass kicked repeatedly which worked out well on the losers day. ;)

[Team Kaos]

Big Weapons my friends...big weapons....it's a trend

[Dainoji]

Big Weapons my friends...big weapons....it's a trend

I'm not going to say big weapons don't deal some massive hits, but after reading your previous posts I started paying more attention to that, and at least for my gladiators, they don't give me any more or less of a problem than other weapon types. As a matter of fact my theatrics gladiator eats 2H gladiators for lunch on a regular basis. I think it has a lot more to do with finding the right weapon for the build you've got. I'll tell you what I have been noticing though is people with a good amount of trains in shield and fighting defensively have been giving me trouble. I think after the total parry change everyone abandoned defense but a few managers have been flying under the radar and tweaking and it's starting to pay dividends. I think my next slave will be a a defensive war build and see how things go.

[Team Kaos]

I'm not going to say big weapons don't deal some massive hits, but after reading your previous posts I started paying more attention to that, and at least for my gladiators, they don't give me any more or less of a problem than other weapon types. As a matter of fact my theatrics gladiator eats 2H gladiators for lunch on a regular basis. I think it has a lot more to do with finding the right weapon for the build you've got

The Black Market so far has been a big weapon stomping ground. A very high percentage of gladiators with extremely high win/loss records have been single handed weapon wielding gladiators, and most of those being Rage.
I'm not saying all the winners but when you check through the high win % gladiators on the lists in the BM they more then likely single handed wielding gladiators.

And another thing that goes against the blade wielding defensive gladiators in the BM is weapon choice. At times it becomes difficult to do enough damage to a single handed heavy armored War when slashing with a dirk or dagger before he gets 2 or 3 big 100+ hits or the blade gladiator tires out while chipping away with 20 hits at 5 and 10 points.

[MostlyDifferent]

Might be interesting tonight to see if/how the market handles a tie for third.

Also, having a crazy-easy time getting high in the rankings with a level 2 gladiator. I imagine the prize may be less than spectacular, though.

[Arkham]

So I took first in the Black Market with a young warrior. Lets assume I fought 3 warriors, at around 1000 gold a piece for the 50 fight entry.

First place took home a ~200 gold blue. Granted that was a 'Young' warrior (my latest), but doesn't he deserve better?

On that broken arena day (there were 2 rotations), I took 3rd and received a nice purple leg. Probably a 20-30 trophier.

So what is the game? The reward system seems a bit off.

[MostlyDifferent]

indeed. Spent 100 gold getting second and it gave a 34 gold leg.

[MostlyDifferent]

well, 34 is what the smith would pay for it. imagine the regular value is higher. still, only marginally better than a tavern drop.

[LordOfTheGods]

i have noticed somthing as well in the black market, i kno the items are generated randomly, but ive notice i seem 2 be generated lower armor most of the time compared 2 my opponent, like most of my armor would be generated with only 2 defense, and they have armor with 9, is it because maybe regularly i have more purple items, so 4 some reason its generating me lower armors than my opponent has, if he doesnt have as many rare items as me?

[Team Kaos]

Are you wearing light and the opponent medium, or are you wearing medium and your opponent heavy? Also check the rank, a higher ranked gladiator will have stronger armor even if it is the same type.

[LordOfTheGods]

Are you wearing light and the opponent medium, or are you wearing medium and your opponent heavy? Also check the rank, a higher ranked gladiator will have stronger armor even if it is the same type.

ohh thank u sir, that explains it the higher rank i generally still win when that happens but i was just curious as 2 why it did

[Dainoji]

So I took first in the Black Market with a young warrior. Lets assume I fought 3 warriors, at around 1000 gold a piece for the 50 fight entry.

First place took home a ~200 gold blue. Granted that was a 'Young' warrior (my latest), but doesn't he deserve better?

On that broken arena day (there were 2 rotations), I took 3rd and received a nice purple leg. Probably a 20-30 trophier.

So what is the game? The reward system seems a bit off.

I don't think you should try and equate the gold buyback price of an item with the amount you spent in the black market to get it. I've never won yet, but from what I've read here on the boards the winners are given an item that they can use which makes sense as they were the one who won it. From the news page I've seen purple, blue and greens awarded and if you win a purple or a blue you really got a Chamber of Power item with your effort and only gold which means you got it for free. The gold expenditures you and MostlyDifferent are talking about are negligible and easily gotten in a few days or less depending on how many gladiators you run and their levels so from where I'm sitting it looks like a pretty good deal, even better if you win! :)

[Adam C]

Massive shot to HARK's abdomen...The grounds keepers are going to have to work hard to clean up this mess! (+984 Damage)

...and he lives?! What does it take to kill someone!?

[Apoca1ypse]

just noticed the changes to the black market layout.

I quite like how points are now displayed (saves the hassle of running an excel sheet) and the way the rulings are displayed are very nice and comprehensive.


Keep up the awesome work Nate :)

on a side note, i'm kinda annoyed that i was 14-1-4 with rarg (lvl12) and then got paired against a lvl 16 three fights in a row and got smashed :( wish that i hadnt spent tokens on energy now....
actually, i gotta stop using tokens on a whim and save up for gear :P

[Apoca1ypse]

sad panda. was 1st till ~10 mins to go. ended up 2nd and got a blue. i was of the impression that all 3 got purples. if not, oh well...

[Sythion]

I'm probably gonna win today as a level 9 glad. Hope I get something cool!

[Sythion]

Worst blue item I've ever seen.

[vihorsthename]

2 minutes for my first black market win. quite excited i am :) (maybe becouse i didn't sleep much tonight)

[vihorsthename]

if anybody is interested what kind reward waits behind black market fights: i got blue item.

[Warmonger]

It can vary. I got a purple one day last week, but that is a rarity for me.

[XBEASTMODEX]

answer me this, why is the scoring system: win: 1 loss: 3 kill: 7 shouldnt you get more points for a win?????

[Narol]

The scoring in the black Market changes everyday and is totally random, so sometimes you have strange scoring system like this one... Of course, it had to happen the day my Larshamir did a 35-0-4 !!!

[BlkTmplr]

I know how you feel Narol...
Lillith: 35-0-4
Ela: 34-1-5

[Dainoji]

answer me this, why is the scoring system: win: 1 loss: 3 kill: 7 shouldnt you get more points for a win?????

the first time I saw the "losers" format I was a bit confused but then thought about it. If I can make my gladiators lose then I now know what NOT to do when trying to win. Not sure if Nate meant it to be a sort of learning format or not, but it actually works fairly well when trying to lose in different ways.

[BlkTmplr]

Heh, I haven't found a way to consistently lose yet... ;)

[Ochrasy]

is the black market a good place to try new strategies?

[Warmonger]

Yes, it's a very good place to try strategies since you will be on a relatively even field. You'll fight people within a few levels of you, and everyone will have the same level of equipment. Though other enhancements to gladiators are still there such as trained stats/skills and achievements.